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Post by toei on Mar 18, 2018 20:13:09 GMT -5
Well, I think it was just NES games they were comparing to, but regardless, Shape Shifter over Metroid? Seriously? I mean, I have played some of that game. It may be okay, but... oof. I also don't think The Legendary Axe holds a candle to Castlevania. The opening paragraph takes some shots at SNES fans by way of Chrono Trigger and other famous games.
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Post by Sarge on Mar 18, 2018 20:22:23 GMT -5
Well, I think it was just NES games they were comparing to, but regardless, Shape Shifter over Metroid? Seriously? I mean, I have played some of that game. It may be okay, but... oof. I also don't think The Legendary Axe holds a candle to Castlevania. The opening paragraph takes some shots at SNES fans by way of Chrono Trigger and other famous games. Dang, I forgot that was there when I posted it. I read it about a week ago. That makes it even more ridiculous.
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Post by Ex on Mar 19, 2018 10:31:52 GMT -5
I owned a SNES and a Genesis growing up, and had access to a TG16. The order from greatest to least is SNES/SFC > GENESIS/MD > TG16/PCE. That's just how it is. That's not any kind of bias. Just pure objective fact. There's awesome stuff on each platform, but averaging the libraries out in totality, the SNES/SFC wins by a mile.
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Post by Xeogred on Mar 19, 2018 14:14:36 GMT -5
3 pages in the Top 5 thread and nobody has a list for the PCE/TG16 yet. Nuff' said?
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Post by Sarge on Mar 19, 2018 14:52:53 GMT -5
Well, I think most of us just don't have enough experience in that realm. That being said, I've tried out a lot of the "best" and have been rather disappointed. It does seem like the clear number one is Dracula X: Rondo of Blood, and even that isn't my favorite classic Castlevania.
And yes, I agree, Exhuminator, there are great games on all the platforms, but in aggregate the SNES far exceeds the libraries of the Genesis/TG-16. The Duo starts to improve once factoring in imports, but even then, the SNES pulls ahead even more because of the absolutely incredible number of great games we didn't get.
I actually still believe, in aggregate, that the NES platformer library is better than the SNES. Yes, the SNES has some all-time classics (Yoshi's Island! Super Metroid!), but the sheer breadth of the NES just blows my mind. Plus, I don't like how a lot of 16-bit platformers handle; sometimes the larger sprites and sprawling, haphazard map designs detract significantly from those games overall.
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Post by toei on Mar 19, 2018 15:39:28 GMT -5
I can't name 10 games I really like on the NES. In fact, the more I play, the less I like it. At least Master System games don't look like garbage, though it admittedly doesn't have much of a library. 8-bit game design is too damn archaic for me. Besides, I'm a RPG fan, and RPGs didn't really become good until the 90s, with some rare exceptions like DQ4.
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Post by Sarge on Mar 19, 2018 15:58:03 GMT -5
Oof, wounding me to the quick here. I'd personally argue that a lot of SMS games still look like garbage as well; those bright garish colors, not to mention having to make do with B-tier developers and in-house projects did the system no favors. I do get the RPG fan portion, though. Much of the NES stuff directly snitches from the Dragon Quest school of design, without the actual charm that went with those games. Straight up great RPGs on the system are harder to find, especially when constrained to the US portion of the library. Dragon Quest III/IV are both spectacular, though, as you say. I'm actually curious which stuff you've played on NES. Maybe we can help point you at some games that you'd actually enjoy? For instance, I actually think overall that the Mega Man series is better on NES than SNES, even when you include the X games. (That being said, Mega Man X is a classic that deserves all the praise it gets.) But some of the low-tier NES games were absolutely atrocious. The 16-bit era helped get rid of some of the absolute worst junk out there, at any rate. Anyway, I might not be the most unbiased source here. I made do with the NES until the end of the SNES lifespan. That means I've played a lot of the best of the system. I can probably name at least 100 games that I feel are worth playing!
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Post by Ex on Mar 19, 2018 16:10:36 GMT -5
I agree the NES is the true king of the platforming genre. The way the math works to handle the physics/scrolling in the NES platfomers... it just "feels" perfect. 16-bit platformers never quite captured the same "feel". I know that's a horribly unscientific way to describe the situation, but it saves me five paragraphs of technical jargon.
The best looking Master System games are untouchable by anything on NES. There are still some great looking games on the NES though.
8-bit land is not the best place to seek JRPG satisfaction, I'll attest to that. There are a dozen or so GREAT 8-bit JRPGs, but the exception doesn't disprove the rule. JRPGs on console started to really take off in the 16-bit era, riding high during 32-bit, and probably peaked in the sixth gen. Although it could be argued they peaked in the 16-bit era too, depending on what one wants from JRPGs.
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Post by toei on Mar 19, 2018 16:59:05 GMT -5
I fell out of love with pure platformers. I can't really stand to play them for more than 15-20 minutes at a time. Side-scrollers that focus more on fighting but include some platforming, I do like, but I could never get into Mega Man. It just feels so rigid. Mario 1 & 3 are still solid, of course. And I like the Master System's colors, usually. Won't argue that there aren't MS games that look terrible, because of course there are, but in general I like how they look. I've tried most NES RPGs, and finished many. I really don't agree that there's a dozen great ones, or even good ones. Aside from DQ3-4, I liked FF3, Just Breed, and Glory of Heracles 2. That's about all I can think of. To me the genre's golden age was the 16-bit era, and the 32-bit era probably the silver age. After that, the average RPG got bloated, corny and overly melodramatic.
I like beat-'em-ups and VS fighters, too. Not the NES's forte, either... There's DD2, but I prefer the PC-Engine versin by far, and that's about it for good ones Mighty Final Fight is kind of mediocre, and River City Ransom would have been much better if it'd been made a few years later Could have had more of a story, more characters, a more involving world to explore...
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Post by Xeogred on Mar 19, 2018 17:17:55 GMT -5
I think if we got super serious about it, it's pretty fascinating just how different the 8bit and 16bit eras are. Some genres evolved, some devolved, some disappeared and new ones emerged. I can sit here and say that overall I like the 16bit era the most in retrospect, even though I grew up on the NES for my earliest years in gaming. But at the same time the comparison seems a bit odd to me in some ways, there's types of games I like on the NES that might not work on the SNES and vice versa. I can easily see how someone might favor one side of the coin though, they really are different flavors overall.
Not to diminish any arguments or comparisons here, just something that came to mind. Then of course that makes the PCE even weirder to evaluate since it's like... 12bit in ways from what I've seen, haha. A weird in between system.
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