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Post by Xeogred on Mar 15, 2018 21:04:59 GMT -5
I thought the zombies sucked majorly in the first. The two cathedral levels weren't too thrilling. Thief 2 was a different flavor but I still loved it. Did you know Stephen Russell voiced Karras as well? Thief 3's story was a big letdown diving too much into the Thieves Guild for my tastes, along with a major engine downgrade and tiny maps, but it still had some amazing levels and the best music in the series to me. I have my nitpicks across the three but ultimately love the first the most and they were all amazing in general.
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Post by Sarge on Mar 15, 2018 21:26:03 GMT -5
Sarge, I used to like RPG’s more when I was younger. The point when I realized something was the matter with me was when I began KOTOR and got bored 3 or 4 hours into it. As for Elevator Action Returns, I guess that’s technically a multiplatform game now cause you can get it on Taito Legends 2 for XBOX and Playstation 2. That might be an easier way for someone without a Sega Saturn or the inclination to emulate one. I played it first on Saturn, though, so I tend to see it as a Saturn game. To be fair, KOTOR actually is pretty boring for the first eight hours or so. And this was while I was in the throes of RPGdom. I still enjoy them, but they have to actually, you know, be good. There's less of them these days, and my tolerance for playing games that long that don't do anything special has decreased significantly.
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Post by Ex on Mar 15, 2018 21:57:05 GMT -5
along with a major engine downgrade There's something about the original Dark Engine where the games just feel "real" and "solid", and that sound engine has never been bettered. I agree that Thief 3's engine wasn't as good. I still enjoy them, but they have to actually, you know, be good. There's less of them these days, and my tolerance for playing games that long that don't do anything special has decreased significantly. I'm with you there. I own tons of RPGs on all kinds of systems, and I would like to give all of them a fair shot someday. But I find that after 30 hours I start to really get tired of an RPG, unless it's doing something really special. What's sad is from the 6th gen onward, RPGs tend to last 40+ hours on average easy, many getting past 70+ hours to finish. I guess if you're in the right mood, or have plenty of free time, that's okay. I find the idea of putting 70+ hours into an RPG to be daunting though. I only play games 2-3 hours a day at most, so a 70 hour RPG is going to take me about a month to finish. And that's if I only play it and nothing else!
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Post by Sarge on Mar 15, 2018 23:50:28 GMT -5
Right, the sweet spot these days for me is 20-30. Which happily coincides with the best of the SNES era. After that, they tended to get a bit bloated. One of the things I love about Chrono Trigger (and FFVI) is that both are blisteringly paced, and resolve in that time frame. Or close to it, anyway; FFVI might take a smidge longer on a first pass.
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Post by Ex on Mar 16, 2018 0:46:15 GMT -5
I should add the caveat though; at this point in my life really long RPGs aren't easy to deal with. But there's always retirement (or increased apathy) to look forward to.
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Post by Xeogred on Mar 16, 2018 22:32:19 GMT -5
Playstation 1: 1. Metal Gear Solid 2. Resident Evil 2 3. Xenogears 4. Final Fantasy VII 5. Suikoden
Metal Gear Solid is a timeless gem for me. Even the voice acting still holds up really well. The OST is godlike. I love everything about this game and still replay it throughout the years. The beginning of one of my top favorite franchises of all time. I was exposed to this one alongside RE2 and FFVII back in grade school. I've already recently raved about RE2 again on the forums, it's just pure bliss to play and Capcom mastery. FFVII I have my nitpicks with, but I love how gritty this game is even from a technical budget level. Nothing else looks quite like it and I love the atmosphere. The Materia system is loads of fun and the game is a blast to play. Flawed but the charm is maximum. Xenogears though, it's like everything 90's sci-fi anime shoved into a nuclear explosion of pure awesomeness along with one of Mitsuda's best OST's next to the Chrono games. I couldn't really dream of something that fits my aesthetic any closer or my preference for more complex storytelling with layers of characters and their own agendas. Suikoden is a masterpiece that's oozing with charm and great storytelling as well. I kind of see 1 and 2 as one huge game since main characters and some things do cross over, but overall when I replayed both a few summers ago I think Suikoden 1 is more fun to play and easier to blast through. I will always recommend both though.
Mega Man Legends, Breath of Fire IV, Vagrant Story (need to beat it), Symphony of the Night (I don't put it above some of my other Metroidvania favorites personally), Mega Man X4, Chrono Cross, Arc the Lad 2, Silent Hill etc are some runner ups off the top of my head...
Like the SNES, the Capcom, Konami, and Square Soft trinity is unstoppable.
Playstation 2: 1. Metal Gear Solid 2 2. Xenosaga III 3. Silent Hill 2 4. Devil May Cry 3 5. Fatal Frame 2
The PS2 is a stranger one to look back on. Some of these had ports on the Xbox or Gamecube, but I think these versions were their main system personally and fit best. This is also when we get into some cross over PC territory where some games can be played in better form there, as mentioned earlier like my experience going from the PS2 version of Deus Ex to the PC original afterwards. But now we have gotten some good remasters of these as well in some collections for newer systems, though some got bad remasters (like Silent Hill 2). So I don't know about you guys but it's a bit tricky to evaluate this one, since the PS2 library is so dense but a lot of these games are on other systems. This feels like a good list though. I've always been among the rare few that still likes MGS2 more than MGS3. I have a thick backlog of JRPG's I still need to play on this system and I really liked FFX (a second time through with the HD release) and FFXII, but I'm feeling ultimately confident that Xenosaga III will never be matched... everything about that game was my kind of thing in every capacity. It has some of the most elaborate dense lore I've ever seen in a sci-fi JRPG by far, the scope of this venture is insanity with some of the best villains in the genre. Devil May Cry 3 has Vergil, quite possibly the most badass character to play as in all of Japanese action games. The game in general is an absolute masterpiece. Silent Hill 2 is an experience like no other and holds up flawlessly, Team Silent were ahead of their time. Fatal Frame 2 is a good one that also holds up really well and is among the best in its genre. Back when Japanese action games and survival horror ruled the scene.
Armored Core 2 and Onimusha 3 stand out a lot, played the heck out of Red Faction too... but I think this system will be easier for me and some hidden gem ideas. This is a system I played tons of games for but most games I haven't replayed much outside of Capcom/Konami material, so it's more one shot hits and old memories of some old games. I am close to owning every PS2 game I *think* I played and or rented at some point in my life, think it'll be around 90 games when I order the last dozen or so I need to get. The biggest physical backlog I own is for this system, sitting at 16 games I need to play or try out so far.
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Post by Sarge on Mar 16, 2018 23:11:59 GMT -5
The only one of those I haven't played through on PSX is Resident Evil 2. But then again, I haven't finished any of those, even though I have access to quite a few... Metal Gear Solid turned out to be the first M-rated game I had the guts to buy. I was so used to self-policing on my game choices so as not to upset my parents that I really did wait until 18, and even then I felt kinda guilty buying it. Thankfully, that all went away because the game was awesome! Seriously, it's definitely one of my favorites on the system. Xenogears comes so close to being one of my absolute favorites, but I just can't forgive it for jumping the shark so much in the second disc. The first disc is primo, grade A material... and even the second wasn't that bad. I think my opinions on FFVII are very well known by now. I think it's good, but definitely not my favorite on the system (which strangely goes to FFVIII). But I remember salivating over the game for years; I'm not sure anything was going to live up to expectations. Coming right off of Chrono Trigger didn't help, even if it pulled at least some DNA from there. I was tempted to throw Suikoden II in my top 5, and honestly, the first game has charms all its own, too. While the second game builds to a crescendo after a rather slow start, Suikoden doesn't have that problem. It manages to excise any fat and create a brisk, fun, 16-bit-style experience on PSX. Weird story, I actually bought my copy in a Kroger, of all places. Weird? Yeah, I think so. That's also where I snagged my copy of Tales of Destiny. Dude, though, your secondary list is all amazing stuff. The only one I haven't played is Silent Hill. Noticing a theme here? Not much of a horror buff. I've played (and enjoyed!) a few, though; Eternal Darkness on Gamecube immediately comes to mind.
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Post by Xeogred on Mar 17, 2018 16:41:18 GMT -5
The only one of those I haven't played through on PSX is Resident Evil 2. But then again, I haven't finished any of those, even though I have access to quite a few... Dude, though, your secondary list is all amazing stuff. The only one I haven't played is Silent Hill. Noticing a theme here? Not much of a horror buff. I've played (and enjoyed!) a few, though; Eternal Darkness on Gamecube immediately comes to mind. Just how far removed are you from playing an old RE game? I wonder if you'd be surprised to see how action and Metroidvania-esque they can be if you checked them out again. I've never really went into RE for the horror, in fact the zombies are the least interesting thing about the entire series to me haha. Outside of the diary of one person at the mansion who slowly documents his body horror transformation in text form being effectively cool, it's the slight camp and sci-fi X-Files territory the series dips into that I love the most. But yeah gameplay wise these are just mechanically very fun games to play for me and especially RE2. More action oriented and gameplay tight than say, Silent Hill and Fatal Frame. If that makes sense. I think you have just a few years on me but I was in a similar situation. My dad was very harsh on ratings and such growing up... but my mom? Nah! So of course, I'd be the sucker kid and convince her to let me buy Metal Gear Solid at Funcoland at one point haha. But I still made an effort to not play it around my dad, back when my TV and setup was in a rec room outside of my own room, so bystanders could walk around. There was a rare chance he'd sometimes stop and check to see what I'm playing or ask, or a single cleavage slip or curse would would have him interrogating me. The funny thing is I felt it would be best to just slot in the case right alongside my other games, so it was right there out in the open. But all you saw on the side was the title! I turned 18 somewhere in the PS2 era and bought my own Xbox for Halo, from that point on my dad didn't care about anything anymore. Yeah we tend to go back and forth a bit on the Xeno's. My counter argument to this is always that... the first disc is an excellent 50 hours of awesomeness, so the text dump after that doesn't bother me. And I just love it all. But it'll always be a huge "what if" they had finished everything. As it stands though it's still conclusive and an amazing adventure for me. But I can see how Xenogears targets a certain anime/sci-fi niche', so you probably need to be a fan of its type going in. I think something like Suikoden or whatnot has broader appeal. You guys know me and my replaying gaming fever, but what happens when I can't bring myself to finish something again that I once loved? I try not to let that ruin my original experience. This is the case with FF8. This is another JRPG back in the day I 100%'d outside of collecting all the cards and absolutely loved. However since then I've tried replaying it at least 2-3 times over the years and always crash really hard. It has a really bad case of constant menu micromanagement having to frequently resetup the Junctions between characters (as they sometimes don't copy over correctly with forced party changes or going to Laguna), and the whole GF system in general is tiresome. Then there's the useable Magic system and the drawing, which I get so OCD about... I burn out hard because of the weird convoluted systems this game has now. But back in the day I had a party setup to where I absorbed 100% of every element, haha. I'll always be proud of that. So, even though I have my issues nowadays, I honestly still look back on FF8 pretty fondly in a weird way. On the flip side I've easily beaten FF7 at least ~3 times over the years, so yeah. FF9 once and FFT twice.
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Post by anayo on Mar 30, 2018 9:14:09 GMT -5
PC
Growing up in the 90’s conditioned me to see PC’s as beige boxes capable of playing games a full generation ahead of what you could play in the living room. In some cases they even stood a head and shoulders over arcades. Nowadays it feels like PC’s just play console games at higher resolutions and frame rates, which I think is lame.
Doom
My Dad let me play this when I was 3 (!) on his MS DOS PC. I loved how spooky and inhospitable Doom was. I liked how it would tease you with weapons, health, and power ups that I could see, but not reach, requiring me to find secrets passageways to obtain them.
Of all the early to mid 90’s FPS’s, I think Doom has held up the best. It may lack the personality of later Build Engine games with their talkative protagonists, but Doom’s handling and mechanical interaction has aged most elegantly of all. Broken down, Doom is fundamentally a 2D shooter like Asteroids, but with a more engaging first person view along with exploration and light puzzle solving. My most recent play through was in 2015 and it kept me enthralled every step of the way. There will never come a day when I don’t feel like another play through of Doom.
Duke Nukem 3D
Doom was great, but all the maps were basically abstract labyrinths. They served no utilitarian purpose outside of a rat maze with a piece of cheese at the end. Duke’s levels were distinct and recognizable - a movie theater, a lounge, an outer space prison, a factory, etc. While the Doom guy was cool with his face indicating his injury level on the bottom of the screen, he was also completely silent. But Duke wouldn’t shut his mouth. “I’m gonna rip em’ a new one.” “Piece of cake!” “Who wants some?” This was around the time that digitized speech in a video game was still a big deal, so it was crazy impressive.
The attention to detail and interactivity were bonkers, too. I’ll never forget the first time I walked Duke up to a pool table, shot one of the pool balls, and watched it fly ahead, bouncing other balls in a chain reaction. Walking up to a toilet and pressing the action button would make Duke sigh, “Ahhh, much better.” while his health gained 10 points. Approach a bathroom mirror and hit the action button and you’ll hear, “Damn, I look good.” In 1996 this was amazing. It’s pretty quaint today, but the lowbrow sense of humor will probably win over those who have no nostalgia for this FPS classic.
Blood
While I played Doom in 1993 and Duke 3D and Quake in 1996, I didn’t find out about this until 2015. It’s dark, twisted, and violent. You would have never seen this on a Nintendo console back when Mortal Kombat fatalities were grounds for censorship.
I like this so much today because it’s never been ported to anything else. Doom has more or less become a 21st century version of “Hello world!” and Duke 3D has seen ports on most major consoles. While Blood is available on modern digital distribution platforms, you still need a PC to play it. So I see it as an exclusively PC experience.
Quake
When I played this as a kid I just thought it was a cool Doom-style game with better graphics. It wasn’t until recently I learned this game singlehandedly catalyzed the CPU and GPU industries. People ran out in droves to buy 3D accelerator cards because of Quake. LGR actually contends this game had something to do with Intel CPU’s prevailing over Cyrix CPU’s, which lacked floating point capabilities and therefore couldn’t play Quake as smoothly. While I think PC’s today have hardware comparably superior to home consoles (especially when it comes to modern VR), we’re bereft of any hot software like Quake to make it grow.
Playing Quake today is as refreshing as it is quaint. There’s no cut scenes, voice acting, or pretensions of cinematic grandeur. You’re just plopped in a maze full of angry creatures that want to kill you. It’s quite lonely and surreal. Games today usually try to create the impression that the enemies have some life or routine of their own outside of trying to murder you. For instance, in a modern game, sneaking up on two guards you might let you overhear them complaining about their boss. Quake dispenses with this completely. It’s almost like a mid 90’s update of classic arcade games like Robotron 2084, where you suddenly appear in an inky void full of death machines. Kill, kill, kill! And don’t die!
Half Life 2
This came out in 2004. I didn’t play this until 2009, but the graphics still floored me. The art direction is incredible. The technology on display was so far ahead of its time, featuring physics simulations integral to the actual gameplay. The only contemporary game console to see a port of this was the XBOX (itself basically a consolized PC), and later next gen machines like the 360 and PS3. That’s what PC games ought to be! Additionally, so many AAA games are full of world building exposition that fails to engage me. In Half Life 2, though, I not only enjoyed playing, but the characters and world won me over, making me personally invested in the cast and narrative.
This is one rare case where I wish I had bought a game earlier than I did. In 2004 my Dad got me a Compaq Presario PC as a Christmas present. The only thing I would have needed to play Half Life 2 would have been a 64 MB graphics card (I had a mediocre 32 MB one). But the benefit of a better graphics card eluded teenage-me, and I was distrustful of Valve’s DRM platform, Steam. I didn’t play it until I completely upgraded to a new (overqualified) PC and The Orange Box came out. Oh well, better late than never.
Honorable mentions:
Halo - I played this to death as a teenager, especially the online multiplayer modes. However, Blood took it’s place, since Blood is a PC exclusive and Halo isn’t.
Shadow Warrior - I really love Build Engine games, but I already had two of those with Duke 3D and Blood. I couldn’t bring myself to dethrone Half Life 2 for a third Build Engine game.
Half Life 1 - I enjoyed this in 2004. It would have rocked my world when it came out in 1998. But by 2004 its age was starting to show.
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Post by Ex on Mar 30, 2018 9:57:23 GMT -5
To touch on those thoughts...
Pretty much. It all started with the original Xbox. One could also argue that modern consoles are just PCs. Either way the homogenization is real.
I too loved this, played it often during 1993/1994. I even made my own levels and custom WADs for it, sharing with other people. But after 1994 I've never really played DOOM again. I also didn't much care for DOOM II (I did beat it though back in 1995). I just got burnt out on DOOM I guess.
I played this when it debuted. I remember being impressed with its Build engine, and thinking the humor was great. I didn't much care for the level or enemy designs though. I think I beat this game once and that was it. The best line that stuck with me; "I’m here to kick ass and chew bubblegum, and I’m all out of bubblegum." Although I later learned this line was lifted from the 1988 movie They Live.
I first played this around 2004 or so. I wasn't impressed at all with Blood or its sequel. I thought that Hexen had already done what Blood was doing, but had done it both earlier and better.
This one blew me away in late 1996. The technology was astounding, and the free-look mouse control a seachange. The atmosphere and violence were rendered to perfection. Plus I was a big fan of NIN back then, so NIN doing Quake's OST was just icing on the death cake. I would argue that Quake II had an even greater impact on PC gamers opting for 3D acceleration cards in their rigs. But I buy the stance that original Quake pushed Intel's floating point processors to the forefront. Quake ran amazingly well in software mode if your CPU could handle it.
I bought this in 2004, I was quite excited for it, as I loved the original. I bought it off the shelf at Walmart, brought it home, opened the box, only to see that despite the fact there was a DVD in the box, I couldn't play this game without an internet connection. Yep, that was my introduction to Steam. I would have to install this unnecessary DRM service onto my computer, let it have unmitigated internet access, and endure automatic patch downloads every time I played, just so I could play something that I legally owned physically. No. I refused. I waited until a crack came out that would negate needing Steam. When I finally did play Half-Life 2, I wasn't blown away. Yes the graphics and physics engines were great. Yes the emotive NPCs were impressive. But the core game design IMO wasn't as good as the original Half-Life. Valve chose to focus on splendor and padding, with silly physics puzzles, and overly long airboat sections... 'eh I don't want to rant. Half-Life 2 isn't bad, but it's like an 7.5/10 in my book. Its sequel "Episodes" improved on things though. Too bad we'll never get a resolution to the saga.
I understand why this was a big deal. For a lot of kids, Halo was their first taste of online FPS. It was online FPS made easy, good move for Microsoft. I've never cared for online gaming at all, so for me Halo was only as good as its offline single player campaign. Which in and of itself was rather bland. However Halo and its sequel both offered split-screen co-op in which to beat said campaigns. That's the approach myself and a long lost friend took. Even so, after having beaten both Halo and Halo 2, I'd only rate them both 7/10. I still need to get around to playing all the 360 entries.
I bought and played this back in 2006... it was hokey and not great. I haven't tried the sequel.
I think this FPS was a masterpiece and a triumph. I didn't play it until 2001, but I still loved it three years past its release window. Nowadays when modern gamers go back to Half-Life, and play it for the first time, they think "what's the big deal"? For them it seems like Half-Life is just a collection of FPS tropes they've already seen a hundred times. What they don't realize is that Half-Life created those tropes. Half-Life single-handedly reinvented the FPS genre back in 1998.
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