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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2020 4:09:43 GMT -5
I'm not into racing games, but I played and enjoyed Episode One: Racer back in the day. Better than the race in the actual movie. Based on that movie, I also played Battle for Naboo and Starfighter (as well as its sequel, Jedi Starfighter). These are all games that tried to carry the arcade-y flight Star Wars genre that started with Rogue Squadron, a seminal SW game. Never could play the two sequel because they were GameCube exclusives. The more hardcore flight stuff that started with X-Wing and peaked with TIE Fighter unfortunately died out. Probably couldn't translate that kind of gameplay to consoles. Speaking of which, I forgot to mention a couple of games last time: Star Wars: The Force Unleashed (2008) Is it God of War with a Star Wars paint job? ... Yeah, probably so. I didn't care much for Kratos, but I sure enjoyed Starkiller's adventure. I went in expecting the worst because of the much maligned QTEs, but they weren't as obtrusive as I feared. The force powers are great fun to use and the physics let you throw all sorts of items at your enemies... as well as the enemies themselves. The game does have a great visual style faithful to the movies, the many costumes and unlockables improve replayability, the story is... decent, even if some stuff really borders on fanfiction. Which isn't far from the mark, since this game is not canon. Some of the boss fights were a bit tiresome to me as the game basically switched to a 2.5D 1v1 fighting screen each time and it felt like a slow battle of attrition at times rather than an epic fight. Very good game though. Played it briefly myself, but worth mentioning how the PS2 version of the game is quite different from the game that came out on PC/PS3 and actually has meatier cutscenes and much more story/dialogue. Star Wars: The Force Unleashed 2 (2010) A much shorter but worthy sequel. Gameplay and graphics are slicker, boss fights not as cumbersome and now Starkiller wields 2 lightsaber at a time, giving you more customization options as far as blade color and stats are concerned. Most importantly, now your attacks sever enemy limbs with reckless abandon - a feature that was sorely missed in the previous game and reminded me of the glorious days of Jedi Outcast. Story is a rush job, to say the least, and Starkiller's love interest, Juno Eclipse, has been demoted to a cardboard character with no lines. Other than that, very good game.
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Post by Ex on Jul 11, 2020 11:06:12 GMT -5
These are all games that tried to carry the arcade-y flight Star Wars genre that started with Rogue Squadron, a seminal SW game. Never could play the two sequel because they were GameCube exclusives. I very much enjoyed the PC version of Rogue Squadron, but I did not at all care for Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader (beat it) or Star Wars: Rebel Strike - Rogue Squadron III (played it). Both games received undue praise for two reasons; they have outstanding graphics and they are Star Wars related. But the core game design and gameplay of both were awful. You didn't miss anything.
Also more levels than the PC/360/PS3 version. The Wii and PS2 versions are basically the same, though the Wii version has motion controls and more advanced lighting than the PS2 version. That said the PS2/Wii versions do not have the advanced physics and particle effects of the PC/360/PS3 versions. I assume you beat both games on the PS2.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2020 12:01:28 GMT -5
I wonder if anyone here played Shadow of the Empire? That's one I missed so far, but it seems one of those 'gaming masterpieces! I mean, if an N64 was all you had....'
I did play Force Unleashed 1 and 2 on the PC. I played a couple of hours of the PSP version (same as PS2/Wii) and seemed solid and worth a playthrough of its own. It does have more story, better fleshed out characters and you can even use your ship as a hub between missions. Physics are not up to par though, obviously.
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Post by anayo on Jul 11, 2020 12:15:43 GMT -5
These are all games that tried to carry the arcade-y flight Star Wars genre that started with Rogue Squadron, a seminal SW game. Never could play the two sequel because they were GameCube exclusives. I very much enjoyed the PC version of Rogue Squadron, but I did not at all care for Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader (beat it) or Star Wars: Rebel Strike - Rogue Squadron III (played it). Both games received undue praise for two reasons; they have outstanding graphics and they are Star Wars related. But the core game design and gameplay of both were awful. You didn't miss anything.
That's exciting to hear, since I have that title installed on my 20 year old gaming PC.
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Post by Ex on Jul 11, 2020 12:38:14 GMT -5
I wonder if anyone here played Shadow of the Empire? I rented it around when it released, and did not like it at all. I guess if you were seven years old and playing the game on N64 back in 1996, it would have seemed amazing though. That's exciting to hear, since I have that title installed on my 20 year old gaming PC. Star Wars: Rogue Squadron turned out great, because Factor 5 handled the technical stuff, but LucasArts handled the game design. However, with Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader and Star Wars Rogue Squadron III: Rebel Strike, Factor 5 handled not only the technical stuff, but the majority of the game design as well. Actually Factor 5 completely developed III all on their own entirely. And you can tell, because II and III are not anywhere near as fun as the original Rogue Squadron. I haven't beaten any of the other Star Wars flight sims. But I own quite a few of them. There's an N64 release entitled Star Wars Episode I: Battle for Naboo, that Factor 5 developed an impressive N64 engine for. If you want to see some technical wizardry on the N64, that's not a bad game to play. Although Star Wars Episode I: Battle for Naboo did get ported to Windows as well. It'd probably play on your retro PC rig.
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Post by Sarge on Jul 11, 2020 14:20:24 GMT -5
There's actually a pretty decent amount of nostalgia for Shadows, and I don't think it's all that bad... but I admittedly haven't played much of it.
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Post by anayo on Jul 11, 2020 17:37:55 GMT -5
1) Quake 2a) Warcraft II: Tides of Darkness (human campaign) 3) Blood 4a) Mechwarrior 2 Pentium Edition: Jade Falcon Campaign 4b) Mechwarrior 2 Pentium Edition: Wolf Clan Campain 5) Shadow Warrior 6) Mechwarrior 2: Ghost Bear's Legacy 7) Doom 2 8) Lego Island 2b) Warcraft II: Tides of Darkness (orc campaign) 9) Road Rash 10) Toy Story Animated Storybook 11) Half Life: Opposing Force 12) Mechwarrior 2: Mercenaries 13) Quake II 14) A.D.A.M. The Inside Story 15) Commander Keen Episode One: Marooned on Mars 16) Commander Keen Episode Two: The Earth Explodes! 17) (too new; don’t discuss on the retro forum until 2029)18) Star Wars Episode One: Racer 19) Lego Rock RaidersDetailed thoughts and impressions coming soon.
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Post by Ex on Jul 11, 2020 20:59:38 GMT -5
anayoI'm learning about so many PC LEGO games I never knew existed thanks to you.
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Post by anayo on Jul 11, 2020 22:45:15 GMT -5
In 1999 Lego came out with a theme called “Lego Rock Raiders”. It was about futuristic miners obtaining green energy crystals while avoiding rock golems in a subterranean world. Either my brother or myself had only one Rock Raiders set. It was set number 4940, Granite Grinder. We would have liked to get more Rock Raiders sets, but for some reason that never happened. Instead we just looked at the cool pictures in Lego magazine and shop at home catalogs. There was also a Windows PC game based on Rock Raiders. Although I have a crystal clear memory of heading out with my Dad to buy Lego Island in 1997, I have no idea how the Rock Raiders computer game ended up in my house. Maybe Dad saw it on discount and picked it up for us? Anyway, I certainly remember the excitement and enjoyment of playing it. The Rock Raiders computer game was an RTS. I didn’t have much experience with that genre, but I liked it a lot. My brother and I have conflicting memories as to why we gave up playing Rock Raiders. I remember the frame rate getting so slow I couldn’t play anymore. My brother remembers the game crashing over and over again at the same part, making us quit. Whatever the case, this game ended up becoming one of those tantalizing titles I got to try as a kid but never fully experienced. Interestingly enough, Rock Raiders has never been re-released or ported to anything else. There is a Playstation game also titled “Lego Rock Raiders”, and I always assumed it was just a port of the PC game, but when I finally got around to looking it up I learned that’s not true at all. Lego Rock Raiders for the Playstation is quite different. So, Lego Rock Raiders for Windows has turned out to be one of those quintessential retro games stranded on its original hardware. You have to go off the beaten path to play it these days. At first I was concerned that Rock Raiders in 2020 would prove to be garbage licensed game that 9 year old me liked just because of the theme. My first impressions didn’t do much to reassure me otherwise. Having since experienced Warcraft II, I now compare every RTS to Warcraft II, and at first Rock Raiders just seemed like WC2 except they replaced lumber with ore and gold with energy crystals. Rock Raiders also seemed to coddle me with kid-friendly explanations for everything. After a while, though, I came to admire how Rock Raiders distinguishes itself from Wacraft II’s conflict of two civilizations trying to destroy each other by doubling down on Lego’s mantra of nonviolence. Various details highlight this, like when your rock raiders’ health bar depletes. Under such circumstances they don’t die, they get “safely teleported back to base”. Similarly, when you damage a rock monster, he doesn’t get killed, he asexually subdivides into two or three harmless tiny rock monsters. These cosmetic choices highlight how Rock Raiders gameplay centers around “man versus nature” conflicts, with challenges like building a base with the ticking clock of an encroaching lava flow, building an air purifier before limited oxygen runs out, and rescuing lost rock raiders. It reinforces the feeling that these guys are trapped on an alien planet trying to get back home. I like how you can hijack one individual rock raider and control him from a first or third person perspective, even getting inside of and piloting vehicles. This proves useful because sometimes the AI is too unreliable and nutty, forcing me to perform important tasks myself. But there’s also a certain element of boyish fantasy fulfillment considering so much of this game’s appeal was to occupy a world filled with interactive, life sized versions of all the cool Rock Raiders Lego sets. I only wish there was a more detailed first person cockpit model when taking control of the larger vehicles, full of knobs, levers, or even the roll cage like on the Granite Grinder. That particular lack of detail disappointed me even as a grown-up. Ironically, I beat the game without invoking any of the large vehicles. I would just use a dozen small drillers and earth haulers, inflicting “death by a thousand cuts” on each stage. Lego Rock Raiders is fraught with technical problems. In his 39:54 world record speed run, Youtuber TurmoilTheCoil explains to a commenter “ This game won’t be at AGDQ because it crashed 9/10 on the last 2 levels.” Personally mine crashed 4 times throughout my play-through. My graphical performance was also very uneven. On my PC it would run smoothly for 3 seconds, then “hitch”, then 3 more seconds of smooth performance, then another “hitch”, forever and ever. Every time it hitched it would eat my keyboard and mouse inputs, which was maddening. If this had been an action game rather than a methodical RTS I wouldn’t have put up with it. I’m not sure how someone with an encyclopedic knowledge of RTS games would rate Lego Rock Raiders. But having just begun to explore the genre I found this to be a worthwhile experience even in 2020. I thought the presentation was childish at first, but by the end I found the quips and dialog to be charming. I would often enter a “zen state” of mind managing my little mining colony. Lego Rock Raiders even had a few triumphant moments where I’d fail a tough stage over and over then finally get it. I probably won’t go back and 100% this title (unlike Star Wars Episode One Racer), but I’m glad I took the time to finish this at last.
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Post by Ex on Jul 12, 2020 12:12:08 GMT -5
anayoAlthough I was too old for Rock Raiders by the time the LEGO series debuted in 1999, my brother wasn't. He was around 12 years old when that series released. And I know for sure my brother had at least one Rock Raiders set, because I remember seeing that rock monster in the ad there, along with a few other pieces in those sets, in his LEGO collection. I too find it gratifying to finish games that remained unfinished from one's youth. It provides a nice sense of closure. After reading your review, it's evident that Rock Raiders harbored genuine depth to its gameplay, despite the technical issues. I like the concept of solving real world problems using RTS mechanics. Definitely an interesting read about a game I had no idea existed.
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