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Post by bonesnapdeez on Sept 16, 2021 12:31:03 GMT -5
Cool stuff toei. I love primordial VNs.
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Post by toei on Sept 16, 2021 12:54:01 GMT -5
I just assumed that Tokimeki Memorial was the first dating sim. Contrary to usual, I did no research about this whatsoever, because I couldn't care less about dating sims. Also, to reiterate my point, I don't think they were trying to "pad out the gameplay" at all. They really didn't have to, as their game is much longer than its contemporaries, and those sections don't add up to all that much (probably 30 minutes or so, out of 10 hours - and there are multiple alternate paths, so there's a lot of material there). I think it's just the awkwardness of an ambitious writer who might not understand the value of conciseness.
According to the credits, there was one guy who wrote the original story, and one who wrote the script. The scriptwriter also worked on other aspects of the game (can't remember if he was the programmer or director or what), while the person credited for the original story has the same name as the main character from that company's previous adventure game, as per mobygames' description of it. It could be that that character was named after him, or it could be that it's just a pseudonym, or even a person that doesn't exist. There are various instances where the game's characters are credited as if they were real people, so it would fit. It also reinforces my impression that these guys were really passionate about their characters and their fictional UK band, since they even credit them for the soundtrack (that's why we have no idea who actually composed the music).
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Post by Ex on Sept 16, 2021 13:30:20 GMT -5
I was not accusing Mirrors of padding out its gameplay. I was just saying many VNs do that, and it annoys me, and is the primary reason I rarely engage with the genre. They can be "bloated" to the point of expositional excess, certainly.
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Post by toei on Sept 16, 2021 15:07:26 GMT -5
I was not accusing Mirrors of padding out its gameplay. I was just saying many VNs do that, and it annoys me, and is the primary reason I rarely engage with the genre. They can be "bloated" to the point of expositional excess, certainly. I'm picturing Golden Sun's trash dialogue, but 30 times more of it and no gameplay. Hell in software form, pretty much.
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Post by Xeogred on Sept 16, 2021 15:13:23 GMT -5
I believe I'd have to be paid to play a VN at this point.
Still want to play some Western adventure PC games at some point though. When will that mood strike? Stay tuned...
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Post by Sarge on Sept 16, 2021 15:25:54 GMT -5
"Sarge slowly perused the unfolding thread before him, bemused that forum denizens would spend any portion of their ever-fleeting waking hours of life discussing visual novels. Most certainly, in a previous life and a time heretofore unknown to those within his current circle of compadres, he had toyed with the idea that perhaps this most strange and intriguing genre of Japanese entertainment could be considered a 'video game'. As this thought laconically rolled around within his cranium, a metaphorical light in the distance appeared, seeming to beckon him into some profound realization, one that could forever shape his views in the years to come. As he moved toward that light, at first flickering and weak, it seemed to increase in intensity, as if his thoughts themselves were providing much needed sustenance to this fledgling brightness. He resolved that he would dispel this darkness, that he would nurture this light into being, so that no shadows of doubt remained about the nature of this insignificant-but-important glimmer. As it sputtered and flared with every idea, Sarge focused more, funneling his own limited energies into a laser-like focus. The light practically danced now, with the vestiges of darkness and uncertainty being replaced with certitude. Most assuredly, Sarge had finally stumbled onto a truth that could no longer be denied; it needed to be shared with the world before this profound thought could be lost to the ether."
Visual novels are wordy choose-your-own-adventure books, yo.
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Post by Xeogred on Sept 16, 2021 15:27:52 GMT -5
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Post by Ex on Sept 16, 2021 20:10:04 GMT -5
I'm picturing Golden Sun's trash dialogue, but 30 times more of it and no gameplay. You nailed it. Let me be clear that the kind of Japanese adventure game where you are interfacing using a menu selection system, is not what I call visual novels. For me visual novels are the ones where there's a dialogue box at the bottom constantly spewing text, to the point that you can enable auto-progression of the text, so you don't have to keep clicking the "next" icon. 99% of the "game" is passive. Visual novels are wordy choose-your-own-adventure books, yo. Except that COYA books tend to have choices fairly often, whereas with a VN you typically might get three choices during 8-12 hours of reading. Unless it's a "Kinetic Visual Novel" wherein you have literally no choices to make whatsoever. To be honest, I consider visual novels to be digital manga at best.
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Post by toei on Sept 16, 2021 20:36:11 GMT -5
Yeah, I also make that distinction between Japanese adventure games and visual novel. The confusion only exists in the West because the latter is much better-known than the first. Regarding the "digital manga" thing, it's ironic that "visual" novels aren't nearly as visual as manga. They're also much wordier.
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Post by bonesnapdeez on Sept 16, 2021 20:46:27 GMT -5
I love visual novels so much. I most certainly do consider them video games, just one of the outlier genres.
The 2000-2010 era seems to be the peak VN decade. I don't think I can say that about any other gaming genre.
They do vary wildly in quality however. Play (or read lol) a "random" VN at your own peril.
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