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Post by Xeogred on Jun 1, 2020 9:13:42 GMT -5
Games that long that are worth playing are rare indeed. I'll put it this way, out of all the RPGs I've ever played, this is the only one where I maxed out my experience level to its absolute limit. I think that was the first ending I got myself, or something similar... taking matters into my own hands I find it interesting that you've beaten this one multiple times, though with so many variables the replayability is definitely there. Also I do understand one could mainline the primary campaign and the finish time wouldn't be nearly as long. Someone could probably beat New Vegas in 15-20 hours if they solely focused on the main story line. I'd wager something like 80% of this game's content is entirely optional. But this WRPG was so damned awesome, that I chose to see every square inch of it. New Vegas dethroned the original Fallout as my all time favorite WRPG - I didn't think that'd be possible! Looks like I last replayed it in June 2018 and Steam says I had 46 hours. On the 360 version I'm pretty sure I beat it around 30 hours. I think those are the only two times I've beaten it completely, but there was another replay on the 360 awhile back when some of the DLC dropped. I think the first time I played it I borrowed it from my roommate.
I'd wager you like the game even more than me or you just don't mind taking months to finish something like this. Regardless of being one of my top favorite games, I get burned out on it after awhile. Maybe because you can sometimes get sucked into a whirlpool of nothing but hours of dialogue. Which Obsidian does better than others, but for me that just tests my patience after awhile.
I could never play these games on consoles/controllers ever again either. With how stiff and chunky this engine moves, you can loot and explore so much faster on a mouse and keyboard. There's also a lot of quality of life mods that tidy up the dialogue boxes, menus, etc. So I commend you for sticking through it on the 360 version haha.
Gameplay wise I still prefer the Deus Ex, Thief, System Shock, Bioshock, STALKER, Dishonored, Prey, etc mold and they're easier to replay for me.
It's not a knock on New Vegas though, but just open world games for me. At some point when you near or reach that level cap, have perhaps permanent gear, a menu bogged down with quests, constantly having to micromanage inventory, and you find yourself in repetitive gameplay loops, my patience starts to let up. That sense of exploration is lost somewhere along the way too. The first half of an open world game is often a more interesting experience than later.
I'm excited to play Obsidian's Outer Worlds whenever it drops on PC (non EGS). I've heard it's a bit more like Mass Effect and maybe kind of like STALKER, it's not truly open world but has some open zones between the planets or something. That might even be a plus to me.
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Post by Ex on Jun 1, 2020 9:33:11 GMT -5
I'd wager you like the game even more than me or you just don't mind taking months to finish something like this. I think both of those statements are true. My gaming sessions average about two hours a night, so 116 hours = about 58 sessions before I finished the game. And yes that was over a span of about 8 months. Although I took a 3 month break at one point. I don't have it in me anymore to beat a 70-100 hour game in say two weeks. I don't have that kind of free time firstly, but even if I did... I would just get burned out after the first week of investing so much time into one sole piece of entertainment. When I was younger it wouldn't have been an issue though. Something changed within my mind after about 35, not sure exactly what... but these days I don't like to play a video game more than three hours maximum per day. A two hour session seems to fit about right. I thought the interface worked well for a controller, but I did get aggravated with how long it could take to load saved games sometimes (on 360 I mean). I also hit some hellacious bugs once in a while, including one that garbled two of my save files. However I was forewarned how buggy New Vegas is, so I kept a revolving cache of four different save files. Which proved to be fortuitous more than once. Oh I get where you are coming from with all of that. Open world games were over-represented last gen, and slopping through a laundry list of "to do" isn't exactly great game design in general, managing piles of mostly crap loot... yeah that stuff can be unfun. I think that New Vegas handled all that better than others of its ilk though. There are aspects of NV that kept me going strong though, which I'll talk about when I review the game. I've dumped plenty of open-world WRPGs in the past before sticking it out with NV.
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Post by Xeogred on Jun 1, 2020 10:25:09 GMT -5
I'd wager you like the game even more than me or you just don't mind taking months to finish something like this. I think both of those statements are true. My gaming sessions average about two hours a night, so 116 hours = about 58 sessions before I finished the game. And yes that was over a span of about 8 months. Although I took a 3 month break at one point. I don't have it in me anymore to beat a 70-100 hour game in say two weeks. I don't have that kind of free time firstly, but even if I did... I would just get burned out after the first week of investing so much time into one sole piece of entertainment. When I was younger it wouldn't have been an issue though. Something changed within my mind after about 35, not sure exactly what... but these days I don't like to play a video game more than three hours maximum per day. A two hour session seems to fit about right. Yeah that's a big difference. I tend to favor playing games in long bursts over the weekends, not so much on weekdays in recent years. And with stuff like New Vegas, I'd get sucked in for like 5-10 hours at a time probably. No doubt that way of doing things is probably a recipe for quicker burnout. If I had a family and other obligations though yeah I'd have to change my habits.
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Post by Sarge on Jun 1, 2020 13:07:05 GMT -5
Seems like you might want to revisit this one later, perhaps on a more focused attempt, to see some of the other branches. Or maybe by then, they'll have a remastered version you can play.
Also, I hear ya on the long RPGs. I have time to do some longer sessions sometimes, but it's rare for me to really plow through a super long game. Breath of the Wild might be one - I probably put in 2-3 hours every single day on it, and I wasn't really sick of it until I hit around the 95 hour mark and I was having a much harder time tracking down new dungeons to explore.
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Post by Ex on Jun 1, 2020 14:12:42 GMT -5
Breath of the Wild might be one - I probably put in 2-3 hours every single day on it, and I wasn't really sick of it until I hit around the 95 hour mark and I was having a much harder time tracking down new dungeons to explore. The only reason I haven't played that one yet, is because of a mental roadblock where I feel I must finish Skyward Sword first. SS and myself didn't get along very well a few years ago. Maybe I'd like it more now though, I don't know.
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Post by Sarge on Jun 1, 2020 14:30:07 GMT -5
They're very, very different experiences, as you probably already know. Skyward is, as someone else put it, "Oops, all dungeons!" There's plenty of dungeoning in BotW, but it's definitely split up a bit differently, and exploring the massive landscape is part of the appeal.
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Post by Ex on Jun 1, 2020 14:44:01 GMT -5
They're very, very different experiences, as you probably already know. Skyward is, as someone else put it, "Oops, all dungeons!" There's plenty of dungeoning in BotW, but it's definitely split up a bit differently, and exploring the massive landscape is part of the appeal. I'm all for the dungeons, those are my favorite parts of Zelda.
SS just has a LOT of bloat and contrived longevity - which I won't get into on this side of the board. I don't think that SS is a bad game or anything, I just wish it was half as long without the repetitive stuff.
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Post by Sarge on Jun 1, 2020 14:45:39 GMT -5
I hear ya. Yeah, wrong place for it, but I get the complaints.
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Post by Ex on Jun 2, 2020 22:52:56 GMT -5
Fallout: New Vegas is a 2010 WRPG developed by Obsidian Entertainment and published by Bethesda Softworks. Fallout: New Vegas – Ultimate Edition released in 2012, and included the original game plus all four of its DLC add-ons, along with two special weapon packs. Fallout: New Vegas – Ultimate Edition was released worldwide (even in Japan). New Vegas is a bit of a gaiden entry in this series, falling in place between Fallout 3 and Fallout 4. This game takes place in a post-apocalyptic wasteland. The player controls a self-made character known as the Courier. When New Vegas starts, the courier is transporting a package across the Mojave Desert to the city of New Vegas, but the Courier is ambushed. They are robbed of their delivery, shot in the head, and left for dead. Miraculously the Courier survives the glancing shot, then begins a journey of vengeance to find their assassinating robber, and recover the package. Along the mission the player will make friends and enemies among warring factions and other denizens of the desert. Ultimately the player becomes mired in a conflict that will determine who controls New Vegas and the Mojave Wasteland itself. Unlike super linear and predetermined JRPGs, true WRPGs offer wide open freedom. In this regard New Vegas is about the truest WRPG I've ever played. The player is given complete and absolute agency to do whatever they wish. Throughout over a hundred sidequests, the main campaign itself, and four large DLCs, the player is never railroaded into a predestined path. The available actions always encompass any moral alignment the player chooses. One can be as angelic or vile as one wishes in New Vegas, being friends or enemies with whoever they choose. New Vegas is a pure conduit of player expression in every capacity, a trait I deeply admired about this game. I'd wager it's even possible to beat this WRPG without ever killing a single being, using pure sneaking, negotiation, and influence instead. Moral-malleability aside, the core of New Vegas revolves around two central aspects; Exploration and scavenging. New Vegas offers a tremendous virtual world to explore, full of intricate detail and forlorn beauty. Among every nook and cranny, ever canyon and mountain, abandoned shack or irradiated mine, there's always loot to scavenge. If the player adores exploration, sometimes only for the sake of exploration itself, New Vegas is as good as that gets. Collecting swag is a byproduct of the exploration, and is indeed a central aspect of the game design. But danger is never far away, one must always be vigilant against impending danger. When it comes to combat New Vegas offers tremendous variety. The player can fight in real time, or pause time and use action-points to sequence out attacks. An incredible amount of weaponry is available, from bare knuckle punches to shoulder mounted nuclear missiles. One can even slip an activated mine into the pocket of an unsuspecting adversary. Or pause time and shoot a grenade out of the air as it flies towards the player. The player can go solo, or assemble a party of NPCs to aid their travels, and control their party members' behavior via radial menus... including having them help fight in battle. Combat is vicious, intricate, cinematic, and always engaging in New Vegas. The amount of content in New Vegas alone is mind-boggling, but the included Ultimate Edition DLC packs basically double that amount. Each DLC has a unique area to explore, with an independent story, plus new enemies and equipment. To try and explain how much content is in this game would be foolish. Let's just say that even with repeated replays, the player will still be discovering new areas, new quests, new characters, new discussions, and new equipment each time through. This WRPG is jam packed crammed with a gargantuan amount of stuff to do and see. I'd have to write pages and pages to explain the complexity and majesty of this experience.
What I liked Exquisite exploration through a vast and somber world. Wide open character development and complete moral freedom.
Intelligent writing and saucy dialogue that is way above average for this medium. Clever combat system that remains fun all the way to the end. A fully realized role playing experience that offers incredible immersion.
What I didn't like A game this complex is ripe for bugs, and there are plenty here (use multiple saves!). Weapons and armor degrade over time (but can be repaired). I wish there were WAY more loading screens, and WAY more songs for the radio. Being constantly hounded by Legion hunting parties if you get on Caesar's bad side. The occasional invisible wall disrupts immersion.
Overall
I wouldn't be the first person to say that New Vegas is the REAL Fallout 3, but I'll add my late vote to that notion. Sure I enjoyed Fallout 3 for what it was, but New Vegas does a much better job of capturing the true spirit of the first two Fallout games. It just feels far more authentic in that regard. Regardless of anyone's previous affinity for preceding Fallout entries, New Vegas can still be played as a standalone adventure regardless.
And what an adventure this game was. I personally put a tremendous amount of time (for me) into beating this game. And that's because New Vegas is the purest, most accomplished expression of the WRPG genre I've had the pleasure of playing. An absolute triumph. Bethesda took a gamble letting Obsidian develop a Fallout entry that might've overshadowed their own previous work. A gamble Bethesda lost, because Obsidian proved the house doesn't always win.
Ex's time to beat: 116 hours 38 minutes
Ex's rating: 9.5/10
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Post by Sarge on Jun 2, 2020 23:26:50 GMT -5
Nice. Love the writeup. If I end up playing this, I'll go PC. Maybe there some of the bugs have been patched up and there will be a lot faster loading.
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